Article with Video: Is BJJ truly practical for self defense?

[Jeff Rockwell]

Over the years I have pretty much become strictly a BJJ guy (with some wrestling and MMA thrown in every now and then), even though I began my training in a JKD Concepts group and have a good bit of experience in other arts.  While I favor grappling for sure, I still like to think I am realistic and intelligent enough to know that it is not the perfect solution to every problem.  I watched the video first, then read the article; nothing really groundbreaking in the article, but the combination is a good reality check when the focus of most of my recent practices have been setups and recounters for the One Leg X-Guard.



http://www.northlondonselfdefence.co.uk/bjj-for-self-defence

[Burton]

Thanks for posting Jeff. I always say that we try to avoid the ground if possible. But if you end up there, what is going to hep save you, especially if you are on the bottom? BJJ and wrestling skills. We don't purposely take the fight to the ground and stay there, but if you are on the ground, your one leg X guard might just get you the sweep you need to get up and get out of there!

Also, there is the phenomena of the "forced challenge matches". This is where a guy picks a fight and his friends circle around to keep it "clean'. Here in Hawaii it is called Up and Up. In that situation, BJJ may allow you to dominate. Just always have to watch for the crowd jumping in.

[peregrine]

If it goes to grappling in the street setting, I prefer to use knee on the belly if on top or knee shield from the bottom. Both allow me access to some aces on my waistline and the ability to disengage quickly.

[Jeff Rockwell]

Good stuff Burton and peregrine.  While I try to keep my fundamentals sharp for the possibility of street confrontations, there are many "sport" moves I have no doubt I could pull off if the right scenario came up, simply because I've trained them so much and used them so much.

Def agree about the knee on belly...though no matter what top position, that front kick from the woman in the beginning of the video I did NOT see coming!  Holy crap, if I was mounted (or knee on belly) on some dude in the middle of the street and the only person I saw around was a lightweight female, I probably would not be too worried about her attacking me...before I saw this video!  One well placed snap kick and that dude was OUT!

[Luis Barneto]

I would like to add this video to the discussion:



Two things to say about it:
1. At 0:50, a guy has a great finishing position (with a little more effort on striking) but, grappling influenced, tries to go for a choke, bringing the guy on top of him. As it can happen, the game changed.
So, for me, the question ends up not being about training grappling or not, but about training it in a way you dont end up doing tactital mistakes that lead to danger, and the BIIIG question is... Can you "avoid" those tactical mistakes, if you train almost always for competition, or based on the competitive way of training grappling or BJJ? Because you fight like you train, right? In the heat of the moment, you can even know what the best tactic can be (sometimes it's almost obvious even for a beginner), but your body end up doing something diferent...
On the other end, how can you become good at BJJ if you only train with street tactics in mind...?

2. Even in those fights where everyone agree not to interfere, there can be a lier like this one, at 1:22...

3. Also, in this video I believe one of the guys has some training on BJJ (at least, he does some good things, like avoiding the other guy of passing his guard, and end up sweeping and going to mount), and the other one had just... heart. Will to win. Interesting to observe how the fight goes, when no referee is there to interrumpt... We have the tendency to believe that once a guy has someone mounting him, and punching him repeatedly, the fight ends, but... Guess again!

[amando]

every martial art can be useless or effective in the streets.  it depends how you practise your art.  as i am a jiujitsu guy, i would like to take the defense of bjj .  indeed , if your instructor is sportsoriented and only trains grappling, then it will be difficult.  but bjj is much more than that.  bjj is striking, throwing, groundfight, stand up self defense.  if you train the complete art, with the focus on street self defense and vale tudo then i am sure that you have chances to survive.  i am sure this is what burton does also in his bjj for the street training; not only grappling, but grappling with adding strikes, position yourself where you can inflict pain, and reduce the risks that the opponent can hurt you . 

[Jeff Rockwell]

Luis, nice video find.  Hate to see that when two guys try to keep it clean and some coward comes in and interferes.  I could see rushing in to help your friend if the other guy starting biting or eye gouging or something, but that was totally BS in that context, IMO.  The guy getting pounded definitely showed heart.  The guy on top showed budo in wanting to finish the fight by submission and not just pounding the guy bloody.  Unfortunately, his skillset was such that he made mistakes trying to get the back and finish the choke.

Armando, like I said, I am a BJJ guy to the bone, and by starting this discussion, I definitely did not mean in any way to discredit or downplay BJJ, or imply that it is not a very necessary (if not the most necessary) skillset to have in a physical confrontation.  For a one on one confrontation, it often reigns supreme in both technique and strategy.  As a longtime practitioner, and having trained in the self-defense and MMA/vale tudo aspects of the art, I was still taken aback by the devastating impact a suddenly violent "onlooker" can have in a seemingly one-on-one situation.  It was a sharp reminder to me of lessons that I already "know", but don't always keep at the front of my mind, and I wanted to share.

Zhoo-zheeeetsssoooo!

[James McRae]

Thanks, Jeff!

I think the article and the video are a case of what we logicians call the fallacy of hasty generalization.  Just because BJJ doesn't work well in some situations doesn't mean that we can leap to the conclusion that it is always useless.  Here's one counter-example.  The first time I was ever in a life-or-death street fight, I crashed into the clinch, threw my opponent to the ground with an o-soto gari, mounted him, and choked him when he rolled face down.  It not only worked; it saved my life.  This worked because my opponent did not have any friends around and my wife (then girlfriend) was with me as backup (she also trains in JKD/BJJ and carries a knife and pepper spray, so she had my back).

As I see it, we need to keep the following things in mind when using grappling—particularly ground fighting—in a self-defense situation:

1.  While it is not true that all fights go to the ground, it is true that most fights involve grappling of some kind, either in the clinch or on the ground.  This can happen because your opponent knocks you down and you have to fight off the floor.  Or he could grab you by the collar/hair or in a headlock so he can strike you with his other hand.  Or he might tackle you.  Or it could be a sexual assault, which necessarily takes place on the ground (or similar surface).  If you're thinking, "I'll just box my way out," you're in for a rude surprise.  Even if you don't want to grapple offensively, you'd better know how to do it defensively.

2.  Grappling can give you a technical/leverage advantage over your opponent.  Most street fighters are sucker punchers who have little grappling experience.  Taking the fight to the clinch can help to neutralize your opponent's ability to strike and allows you to bring your most vicious striking tools to bear: headbutts, elbows, knees, etc.  You also can slam your opponent to the ground with a hard throw/takedown (and you can hit a guy much harder with the pavement than you can with your fist). 

3.  Many people say that you don't ever want to grapple if weapons are involved.  However, all disarming and weapon retention skills are based on grappling.  How are you going to protect your own weapons and control your opponent's if you don't know how to grapple?

4.  Many people say that grappling is useless in multiple attacker scenarios.  I disagree.  The first time I was in a multiple attacker fight (before I trained in the martial arts), one guy grabbed me from behind while in a bearhug (surprise attack) while the other guy tried to strike me.  Fortunately, I was able to squirm out of the bearhug and tee off on the striker, at which point the other guy backed off.  Knowing how to escape the clinch and avoid takedowns is vital to surviving multiple attacker scenarios.  Also, it is often advantageous to clinch with one attacker and use him as a shield against the others (e.g., in a RNC or Thai clinch).  You can use throws to slam one opponent into another (one of my favorite tactics during sparring).  As Burton mentions above, you might be in a challenge match in which multiple attackers are not a threat. 

5.  Grappling is merciful.  In our litigious society, you can't just tee off on every attacker and expect the courts to be on your side.  Many self-defense situations involve protecting yourself against less-than-lethal force (e.g., the guy who wants to beat you up, but not kill you).  Grappling allows you to take your opponent out of the fight without injuring him, which will help you in the eyes of the police and the jury.

6.  The ground is hard and abrasive, and it could be covered with debris.  This doesn't mean we should never go to the ground.  It just means that when you go there, you need to maintain a dominant top position so that your opponent is the one on the hard, abrasive, litter-covered ground.  Thus, positions like knee-mount are better than positions like the guard (if you get a choice in the matter).

[Shelt]

Jim pretty much hits any points I'd make!

I'll just add, many of the people who would offer opinions have never trained grappling and have no real understanding of the value of the attributes grappling training develops...... or they only trained sport-oriented grappling and have never looked at the application of grappling in a fighting context and have failed to develop the powerful tools needed for fighting using grappling.

[MaxD]

In any self-defense situation, or even challenge fight, 360 awareness is crucial.  Judo, standing grappling, Knee on belly, or if you can maintain distance and plan that escape.